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ZONES for player shops to help keep walkways clear like how you can't be too close to an NPC.


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Nothing worse than playing "click to move" and you can't get anywhere because you are constantly clicking on player shops. Sure early on this wont be a problem but as the server fills it will become one. It would be nice to have "allowed zones" for placing your shop. Basically NPC area's and "main walk-ways" should be kept clear. Place your shop elsewhere. Also make it so you can't place a shop too close to another player. I remember them overlapping and that is such a pain in the butt. Its a small quality of life change that could really enhance the overall feel.

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Junon Polis won't be the same without all of the shops but I do get your point.  Moving around in a crowded area can be difficult and laggy depending on your pc and internet connection.  There already is something in the game that prevents you from setting up a shop within 10m of an NPC but there was also some sort of glitch/cheat that some people used that let them set their shops closer.  I remember spending a lot of time reporting people whose shops were in places where I could not set my shop when I first started playing at NA.  

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7 minutes ago, HoneyBuns said:

there was also some sort of glitch/cheat that some people used that let them set their shops closer

Yeah, movement speed glitch. It was similar to the sit and double tap to shoot forward glitch. Luckily I think all those small glitches will be fixed during alpha and beta so most small exploits should be weeded out.

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25 minutes ago, HoneyBuns said:

Junon Polis won't be the same without all of the shops but I do get your point.  Moving around in a crowded area can be difficult and laggy depending on your pc and internet connection.

I agree, I don't think we'd want to eliminate the dense shops all together but having the walkways cleared and requiring some minimum distance between shops so they don't clip into each other would probably help make it look less like a wall of shops. Probably could use a feature to hide shops as well as they're actually a big source of performance issues.

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1 hour ago, lazypenguin said:

I agree, I don't think we'd want to eliminate the dense shops all together but having the walkways cleared and requiring some minimum distance between shops so they don't clip into each other would probably help make it look less like a wall of shops. Probably could use a feature to hide shops as well as they're actually a big source of performance issues.

Hiding shops sounds interesting tho there would still have to be a way for people to know there IS a shop so they can buy stuff ofc.   Most players set their shops on the side of Junon Polis where Mildun is and that's also where one of the main spawn spots is located.  I'm sure that adds to lag because you literally spawn in the most crowded area of the city.  Maybe moving the spawn spot a bit further up past where the vacationing Premium Shop NPC's were could be one solution for that.  I think the spawn spot on the bridge near the mayor is fine as it is.  Same with the spawn spot on the JCF side.  

As for walkways, the area where my clan used to hang is plenty wide enough for both a walkway and shops as is the area near storage but past that as you head towards Belia, it gets more narrow so maybe forcing shops to be some distance apart is the answer.  That way there would be space to click to move while still giving players the chance to check the shops if they want to.

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It would be cool if walking paths (marked red in picture) will be shop free. But ofcourse also for other cities.

If players try then they can get the error: "It isn't safe to place a shop in the middle of the street. Place find a safer spot to open your shop."

rosenoshopszone.jpg

Edited by Zeror
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5 hours ago, lazypenguin said:

Yes this is a good suggestions. I do enjoy having a lot of shops but when there's too many and you can't even click to move it is too much.

good solution for this would be to add an option, like shift + left click, to move without interactions.

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42 minutes ago, Zeror said:

It would be cool if walking paths (marked red in picture) will be shop free. But ofcourse also for other cities.

If players try then they can get the error: "It isn't safe to place a shop in the middle of the street. Place find a safer spot to open your shop."

rosenoshopszone.jpg

Shops are rarely set up back there by the docks but I get your point.  The idea of there being some key(s) you could use to click to move without interacting with shops is also good and possibly better for the overall effect of a busy city with many shops where you can search for a bargain.

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1 hour ago, Zeror said:

It would be cool if walking paths (marked red in picture) will be shop free. But ofcourse also for other cities.

If players try then they can get the error: "It isn't safe to place a shop in the middle of the street. Place find a safer spot to open your shop."

rosenoshopszone.jpg

When I read the title of the post, this as the first idea I had. Do this. This makes sense. 

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Why not make a Market area NPC that will load you to a separate map, that is specifically for shops?

This completely removes the massive lag hit of crossing the threshold of a town entrance, or loading into the spawn point of a town as the shops tank your PC performance.

I want to see the town and be able to click on NPCs and interact without lagging towards my destination.

If I want see what the shops have, I could head to the market. At least I'm choosing to be laggy for a moment and deal with performance issues versus having to deal with it no matter what.

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16 hours ago, Zeror said:

It would be cool if walking paths (marked red in picture) will be shop free. But ofcourse also for other cities.

If players try then they can get the error: "It isn't safe to place a shop in the middle of the street. Place find a safer spot to open your shop."

rosenoshopszone.jpg

This is EXACTLY what I was thinking. Thanks for making a visual.

 

On that note, there is plenty of room in all cities to place shops while still having pathways clear. I think back to other classic mmorpgs like Ragnarok where they eventually made walkways clear of shops and it worked extremely well. So in my mind, no reason not to. And having each shop have a zone of influence so that other shops wont clip would greatly help the overall use and aesthetic. 

 

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On 7/27/2022 at 10:45 PM, HoneyBuns said:

Shops are rarely set up back there by the docks but I get your point.  The idea of there being some key(s) you could use to click to move without interacting with shops is also good and possibly better for the overall effect of a busy city with many shops where you can search for a bargain.

It's not about the docks. This was the first picture i could find where you can see the ground (of Junon polis) best.

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On 7/28/2022 at 12:44 AM, Ilsalay said:

Why not make a Market area NPC that will load you to a separate map, that is specifically for shops?

This completely removes the massive lag hit of crossing the threshold of a town entrance, or loading into the spawn point of a town as the shops tank your PC performance.

I want to see the town and be able to click on NPCs and interact without lagging towards my destination.

If I want see what the shops have, I could head to the market. At least I'm choosing to be laggy for a moment and deal with performance issues versus having to deal with it no matter what.

Passing foot traffic = lots of customers. We'd basically be affecting people's sales (maybe forcing a higher pricepoint on basic goods) if we forced them to another map.

 

lazy's idea of switching shop visbility on and off could still work fine if we allowed advertising on noticeboards in Junon Polis (by Eva etc.). Players could even buy city-wide or even server-wide trade chat advertising. Yes, that's right: players can pay the server for advertising their ingame goods and services. Cha-CHING! Ofc you'd need someone to curate those ads beforehand. 

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This is likely a feature available in private servers - not something that was official.

There was an NPC in every town, that was essentially a world Market trader. Talk to him, type in what you were looking for, and he'd show you who was selling it, what the price was, and where the shop was located (coordinates and map.)

 

I'd really like my game play experience not be impacted by hundreds of shops on the screen - unless I choose to do so by visiting the market area/district. Which as someone previously stated - could be possibly fixed by optimizing the game client to not tank your game performance. How big of an ask that is, couldn't say.

6 hours ago, Bobbity said:

Passing foot traffic = lots of customers. We'd basically be affecting people's sales (maybe forcing a higher pricepoint on basic goods) if we forced them to another map.

 

lazy's idea of switching shop visbility on and off could still work fine if we allowed advertising on noticeboards in Junon Polis (by Eva etc.). Players could even buy city-wide or even server-wide trade chat advertising. Yes, that's right: players can pay the server for advertising their ingame goods and services. Cha-CHING! Ofc you'd need someone to curate those ads beforehand. 

Having an option to turn shop visibility off would work - but how would that be any different from taking away their foot traffic? People would turn the option on when they wanted to shop, which is no different than going to the designated map where they are set up.

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I feel there is a difference, however small. Shops might not be visible but they can definitely be 'heard', trade chat would still be visible in the same map. Moving towards a Junon Agora/Bazaar/Souq map is a step bigger than flipping what might be a switch visible on the player HUD. Having said that, you're right that the difference is small, and the potential gain to performance is large for some players.

People come to Junon Polis not just to buy player vended items but to chit-chat, quest etc. One could even call the latter a primary draw. Removing completely the presence of player vendors by one step (making the process less transparent) disaffects the impulse buys and  compassionate purchases that small-time vendors depend on to survive. Essentially, the only players that will truly benefit from a dedicated agora map would be the clan merchants and other players with high rep / high visibility. The loudest voices, in other words. Other voices will be silenced through a chilling effect. Will you be the voice for the voiceless? If smalltime merchants have to pay for world or server advertising, will you open your wallet? 

 I used to make a living crafting and selling PAT items as well as endowed and reinf armor to order. It ran on word-of-mouth as I significantly undercut the existing market and only sold high quality high-substat items. All good, right? But there is NO WAY I'd have had business if I had to peddle my wares and services in a dedicated agora against clan vendors occupying the best spots and away from the rest of the playerbase. Trying to make a living as an artisan is a hit-and-miss affair at best even when you're known among the masses. I spent real money to buy premium, trading it for zulie to get my name out there. I'd queue for CoU, CD, AA etc to get my name out there. I don't know if you've ever had to do that kind of work as an artisan but you're definitely not seeing what people at grassroots level see .

 

 

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