Ammo is extremely annoying

[Corrision]

It's really annoying that ranged classes that use ammo have to use up extra inventory slots keeping extra ammo, and even more annoying that when you run out of your stack of 999 ammo, you have to re-equip a stack of ammo. Instead, make ammo an item that you only need to get once. make it more expensive, on par with an off hand weapon like a shield or something. Then, it never runs out. It would remove a ton of the tedium. Also, ranged classes won't feel like they're penalized for seemingly no reason. It's not like paying for ammo makes you stronger than regular classes, just on the same level. 

[Avatar]

17 minutes ago, Corrision said:

It's really annoying that ranged classes that use ammo have to use up extra inventory slots keeping extra ammo, and even more annoying that when you run out of your stack of 999 ammo, you have to re-equip a stack of ammo. Instead, make ammo an item that you only need to get once. make it more expensive, on par with an off hand weapon like a shield or something. Then, it never runs out. It would remove a ton of the tedium. Also, ranged classes won't feel like they're penalized for seemingly no reason. It's not like paying for ammo makes you stronger than regular classes, just on the same level. 

So like, instead of purchasing 999 arrows, bullets, or cannons, you simply purchase 1 and the game uses that 1 to have an infinite amount? 

I like this idea! You’ll be using 1 space at most instead of 5, 6, or more. Maybe even switch it to be under the consume tab like previous people have mentioned. 

[Corrision]

Thanks and yes, just like you said, you'll purchase one item that will last forever. It would remove a bit of headache for ranged classes without changing any of the numbers. TBH instead of the consumable tab, it should go in the equipment tab, as it's a one time equip that you will permanently have on your character. I don't think it should be able to get any bonus enhancements, though. It will retain the same damage bonus as the current ammo system.

Edited February 5, 2023 by Corrision

[Heatfist]

Paying for ammo does make the class stronger if you get the higher quality stuff. It increases damage.

the alternative to filling up etc with ammo is to have an artisan craft the ammo in crates which can be stored in the consume tab instead.

Ammo stacks normally do reload by themselves after the first 999 is depleted there is an equip sound effect and the new stack is auto added (this may be bugged sometimes and not happen).

Imo I’d prefer if ammo could be put into PAT inventory instead of ETC, and as others suggestion before to have back items like quivers, bullet pouches, cannon cases etc where the ammo could also be stored independently from the main inventory slots. Another idea was to increase the overall stack amount too, which would be fine as well since it takes up less space but still applies the weight.

Making infinite bullets would take away from the artisans crate crafting. 

Ammo has the annoyance to always need to plan in advance and restock. Melee has the annoyance of the weapon breaking super fast and needing repairs or repair hammers in inventory. Also as mentioned in the other post, farming one spot indefinitely should not be a thing. You should have to leave the spot and restock every now and then.
 

[Corrision]

Another thought that I had, if the new bullets would be equips, they should go into your shield slot, just like an offhand when using a wand. The arrow, bullet, and Cannon ammo boxes on the right side should be removed entirely, since no character would ever use more than one of these at a time.

 

[Avatar]

We can instead convert it to like additional inventory space or something. Maybe even pet inventory

[DoubleRose]

Lots of threads on this with similar ideas. Devs should take note that they keep popping up. People want ammo in pat inventory, bigger stacks, or infinite of the most basic type of ammo.

 

[Bobbity]

I want the devs to get off this free-ammo-as-default nonsense as soon as they can. Let the NPCs in AP, Luxem, Zant, El Verloon and Junon give free ammo as part of quest rewards based on class. That way we can stop using artificial zulie sinks like the Winter Festival; players will have to buy real ammo or craft it. Since launchers are still meta despite the latest patch, the urgency to insert some more basic ammo crafting recipes that use NPC-sold metals hasn't faded. Let the crafters craft their ammo from loot or buy it - again, using metals they can loot or buy from NPCs. Let the ammo have its own tab so that Backpack Mastery can actually see some use, or use the Consumables tab. 

(ASIDE: THERE STILL IS NO SHELL RECIPE LOWER IN TIER UNDERNEATH BOMBER SHELLS (Gunpowder Packet + Tiar). 

 

No need to remove the other types of ammo slots; whenever I run out of shells/bullets in Ruins, I craft bone arrows and a bow so I can keep being useful. I also keep spare ammo in those slots for party members. If we still get to reset freely later, the other ammo slots will be used again, usually when dealing with bosses that are downed more easily with another type of weapon or strat.

 

 

 

[Caly]

Finding and using different ammo types could be a fun experience if the system wasn't a pain in the ass.

To make matters worse a class like Scout can't even craft their own arrows. Are you telling me a survivalist who has mastered the bow and is in tune with nature enough to tame animals can't even craft a single arrow they need for self defense? It just doesn't make sense. This is the only game I've played where a ranged class can't supply their own ammunition.

Edited February 8, 2023 by Caly

[DoubleRose]

1 hour ago, Caly said:

To make matters worse a class like Scout can't even craft their own arrows. Are you telling me a survivalist who has mastered the bow and is in tune with nature enough to tame animals can't even craft a single arrow they need for self defense? It just doesn't make sense. This is the only game I've played where a ranged class can't supply their own ammunition.

Maybe scouts should be able to craft arrows and food because both would fit with a survivalist theme. 

[SupaSpork]

4 hours ago, DoubleRose said:

Maybe scouts should be able to craft arrows and food because both would fit with a survivalist theme. 

i mean, taking crafting away from the crafting job, seems kind of stupid as well.

  

5 hours ago, Caly said:

Finding and using different ammo types could be a fun experience if the system wasn't a pain in the ass.

To make matters worse a class like Scout can't even craft their own arrows. Are you telling me a survivalist who has mastered the bow and is in tune with nature enough to tame animals can't even craft a single arrow they need for self defense? It just doesn't make sense. This is the only game I've played where a ranged class can't supply their own ammunition.

If they do make arrows, it should only be the basic arrows in my opinion, no reason to think that just because someone is good at using a bow, means they have the ability and proficiency to make GILDED arrows

Edited February 8, 2023 by SupaSpork

[Caly]

5 hours ago, SupaSpork said:

i mean, taking crafting away from the crafting job, seems kind of stupid as well.

  

If they do make arrows, it should only be the basic arrows in my opinion, no reason to think that just because someone is good at using a bow, means they have the ability and proficiency to make GILDED arrows

I'm not asking to remove crafting from Artisan, they would still be able to craft arrows for a lazy Scout. I just want Scout to be able to craft the items it needs to function. At the end of the day Artisan will be fine and profitable regardless if Scout can make its own ammo.

[Bobbity]

I support survivalist skills on scouts and even dealers, so I support fletching skills for hawkers/scouts as well as being able to turn kills into food. I figure being able to craft arrows could work like party buffs, in that they're level-locked in tiers. A level-100 hawker could craft the equivalent of White Night arrows, a level 10 hawker could only craft bone arrows. The simple truth is, without crafting bonuses or a crafting hammer, a hawker's highest level of crafting will only ever match that of a level 50 dealer. There will be no competition with artisanal crafting.

Having a backpack or a quiver could add another tab of ammo-only storage space.

[DoubleRose]

5 hours ago, Bobbity said:

There will be no competition with artisanal crafting.

Exactly, would be different. Scouts scout around, so a mechanic related to maps would be fitting too. Only thing that immediately comes to mind is that they could make or find return scrolls. They would have to be return scrolls to noncity maps such as MoG or FoW because those would be the unexplored places of the Rose world. 

[dbeeeee]

On 2/5/2023 at 2:38 AM, Heatfist said:

Paying for ammo does make the class stronger if you get the higher quality stuff. It increases damage.

the alternative to filling up etc with ammo is to have an artisan craft the ammo in crates which can be stored in the consume tab instead.

Ammo stacks normally do reload by themselves after the first 999 is depleted there is an equip sound effect and the new stack is auto added (this may be bugged sometimes and not happen).

Imo I’d prefer if ammo could be put into PAT inventory instead of ETC, and as others suggestion before to have back items like quivers, bullet pouches, cannon cases etc where the ammo could also be stored independently from the main inventory slots. Another idea was to increase the overall stack amount too, which would be fine as well since it takes up less space but still applies the weight.

Making infinite bullets would take away from the artisans crate crafting. 

Ammo has the annoyance to always need to plan in advance and restock. Melee has the annoyance of the weapon breaking super fast and needing repairs or repair hammers in inventory. Also as mentioned in the other post, farming one spot indefinitely should not be a thing. You should have to leave the spot and restock every now and then.
 

Higher quality ammo does increase the dmg (albeit very minimally - you’ll notice like a 10ap difference using the free one vs the one you can buy in orlo). Your suggestion tbh of crafting crates is a bit unrealistic bc the higher quality ammo for ex: blaze shells cost 5 fire ores to make 1 crate of 100. That means to make 999 youll need 45 fire ores = around over 1 million zulie. Is that really realistic for anyone to make to get a 10 ap bonus if we need to literally spend TIME and a ridiculous amount of zulie for 1 stack of good ammo?? 
 

either let ammo stack and be completely weightless and also stack to more than 999 since its so manual changing it out to avoid getting stuck freezing mid battle or let us buy all types of ammo from the npc for a reasonable amount of zulie 

[Heatfist]

1 hour ago, dbeeeee said:

Higher quality ammo does increase the dmg (albeit very minimally - you’ll notice like a 10ap difference using the free one vs the one you can buy in orlo). Your suggestion tbh of crafting crates is a bit unrealistic bc the higher quality ammo for ex: blaze shells cost 5 fire ores to make 1 crate of 100. That means to make 999 youll need 45 fire ores = around over 1 million zulie. Is that really realistic for anyone to make to get a 10 ap bonus if we need to literally spend TIME and a ridiculous amount of zulie for 1 stack of good ammo?? 
 

either let ammo stack and be completely weightless and also stack to more than 999 since its so manual changing it out to avoid getting stuck freezing mid battle or let us buy all types of ammo from the npc for a reasonable amount of zulie 

Fire Shells require Fire Stones which are dusted off from Dirty Stones. They are definitely not worth millions. What players have prices set as is simply player greed. The concept of crate crafting was to be able to pick up and craft using drops on the go. I do agree it should be more simplified and increase the amount of how much can be crated. I’d also like to see an alternative option of Artisans being able to take ETC items and store them within 999 stackable crates as well. This would allow to purchase  ammo and then crate it into the consumable tab instead of cluttering ETC tab. 

I can’t do anything about how the previous developers at Gravity decided their crafting shenanigans for Artisans. It’s currently pretty dull but still useful if needed since job skill resetting is free and one can craft using drops on the go instead of having to go back to town but the amount overall doesn’t make it worthwhile in the end. Plus there’s also the overall weight to consider. 

Unlimited ammo would be way too convenient. If that’s the case then might as well remove durability on weapons as well. 

 

 

[Caly]

5 hours ago, Heatfist said:

Unlimited ammo would be way too convenient. If that’s the case then might as well remove durability on weapons as well.

Durability exists in mmorpgs as a money sink that helps keep the economy (somewhat) in check and ranged weapons have durability as well. This money sink doesn't apply to ammo because you can get it for free. I honestly would rather have melee weapon durability then deal with a bad ammo system. Plus Cleric and Mage already don't have to worry about this despite being ranged.

Also do we even know if melee weapons have less durability then ranged? My crossbow feels like it breaks just as fast as my melee weapons. I want to see the data.

Edited February 12, 2023 by Caly

[dbeeeee]

7 hours ago, Heatfist said:

Fire Shells require Fire Stones which are dusted off from Dirty Stones. They are definitely not worth millions. What players have prices set as is simply player greed. The concept of crate crafting was to be able to pick up and craft using drops on the go. I do agree it should be more simplified and increase the amount of how much can be crated. I’d also like to see an alternative option of Artisans being able to take ETC items and store them within 999 stackable crates as well. This would allow to purchase  ammo and then crate it into the consumable tab instead of cluttering ETC tab. 

I can’t do anything about how the previous developers at Gravity decided their crafting shenanigans for Artisans. It’s currently pretty dull but still useful if needed since job skill resetting is free and one can craft using drops on the go instead of having to go back to town but the amount overall doesn’t make it worthwhile in the end. Plus there’s also the overall weight to consider. 

Unlimited ammo would be way too convenient. If that’s the case then might as well remove durability on weapons as well. 

 

 

Noones uses fire shells. They do less dmg than the ones from orlo npc and its way more cost effective to just imbue your weapon with an element rather than wasting hours every week crafting ammo. 
 

im not even sure you play a bourg

Edited February 12, 2023 by dbeeeee

[Jamie]

The ideas I like the most to  solve the ammo issue are 

• Make the stacks larger, 9,999 would be great and you could just have all in your ammo slot so not to use space in your inventory.
• Add a Ammo tab to your inventory as there is space on the bar after materials.
• Move Ammo to consumables, where you generally have less items.

But would be great quality of life improvement for sure!

[Sumbudy]

The only thing is it wont be just the ammo that can go to 9999, it will be every item that has a cap, so ideally, all spaces will have 9999?

[Bobbity]

Ammo tab sounds alright. Moving it to consumables sounds good too. Also, maybe make Gunpowder Packets very slightly cheaper at the NPC too and give a recipe to turn Gunpowder + a Cloth material into Gunpowder Packets, and a recipe to craft Gunpowder as well from stuff like Coal. That'd be a great QoL improvement right there. It'd make grenades/explosives crafting a more attractive option as a knock-on effect.

Not sure about the 9,999 stack thing, for reasons stated.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Bobbity

[Jamie]

5 hours ago, Sumbudy said:

The only thing is it wont be just the ammo that can go to 9999, it will be every item that has a cap, so ideally, all spaces will have 9999?

Why wouldn't it be able to be limited to Ammo?

Ammo already has its own property's separate to other materials.

[jodenz]

can we have a separate inventory for Arrows, Bullets, Cannon and give space for loots, it is a pain having half or your inventory with ammunition on it.

 

Thanks

[cn]

A fix would be to make the 3 ammo slots universal and allow the offhand slot to carry a stack.  This would be 4 stacks carried without impacting inventory.  Decent compromise if it's easier to implement than other more complex solutions.  

[Mewi]

It'd be cool to have ammo take an equip-slot that's a permanent fixture. Comes with stats and whatever else.