rayun Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 There could be also skill for teleportation to maps, to be able to teleport to specific maps/cities assuming you have been there before. It could be even job/class specific skill or general one, and have success rate (based on history or some pots/items?) and limit how many times can be used per hour or day Skill could be for current character only, or even AOE based, or like "stargate" with specific limits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uliche Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 be great for premium players. idk if it may fall in pay to win realm for paying premmy and getting this awesome portal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 2 minutes ago, Uliche said: be great for premium players. idk if it may fall in pay to win realm for paying premmy and getting this awesome portal. Can I ask how teleportation may fall into the p2w category? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayun Posted December 8, 2022 Author Share Posted December 8, 2022 Personally i see only combat/refining and specific economy things are p2w as other things are more moralic "p2w" what doesnot really matter in general. Same time, game developers does need money to keep game running/maintained, so there must be ways them to make money without turning game to cashgrab. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoneyBuns Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 We had teleportation tickets at NA that could be used to travel to any map or planet if you had the required level. I haven't seen anything yet to indicate whether we will still have them or not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnasty Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Avatar said: Can I ask how teleportation may fall into the p2w category? My reasoning is that you can grind and farm much faster, thus getting to max level and become richer super quick and easy? Not sure if that falls into everyone's definition of P2W though... Edited December 8, 2022 by Gnasty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayun Posted December 8, 2022 Author Share Posted December 8, 2022 6 minutes ago, Gnasty said: My reasoning is that you can grind and farm much faster, thus getting to max level and become richer super quick and easy? Not sure if that falls into everyone's definition of P2W though... I think it would qualify as part of "quality of life". Anyways soon we will see what is what Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Gnasty said: My reasoning is that you can grind and farm much faster, thus getting to max level and become richer super quick and easy? I can see where you’re coming from, I do. Teleport scrolls, at most, will probably allow you to end up at a location maybe a minute before someone without teleportation tickets. There are scrolls for nearly every map, so time wasted is just from main city to teleport ship. It also has nothing to do with becoming rich super quick and easy. It’s a teleport scroll. It would be no different from someone having a Junon Scroll and someone who doesn’t who is in Anima Lake together. Sure the one with the Junon scroll is able to get ready faster and start leveling again sooner, but how is that game breaking? Uniques will still have the same drop rate, the spawn rates will still be the same, I just don’t understand. I hardly think that comes anywhere near P2W. EDIT: After a discussion on discord, I can now see how it could be considered a P2W item. Edited December 8, 2022 by Avatar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnasty Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Avatar said: I can see where you’re coming from, I do. Teleport scrolls, at most, will probably allow you to end up at a location maybe a minute before someone without teleportation tickets. There are scrolls for nearly every map, so time wasted is just from main city to teleport ship. It also has nothing to do with becoming rich super quick and easy. It’s a teleport scroll. It would be no different from someone having a Junon Scroll and someone who doesn’t who is in Anima Lake together. Sure the one with the Junon scroll is able to get ready faster and start leveling again sooner, but how is that game breaking? Uniques will still have the same drop rate, the spawn rates will still be the same, I just don’t understand. I hardly think that comes anywhere near P2W. EDIT: After a discussion on discord, I can now see how it could be considered a P2W item. Where I'm coming from? Yeah, I saw the discussion and that benefit definitely sets the idea of P2W. For those that didn't see the discussion. Let's say there is a King set up for grabs. Then the one with the scrolls will always win over the ones that don't have them. That's pure P2W and it's only one example out of probably many others. 35 minutes ago, rayun said: I think it would qualify as part of "quality of life". Anyways soon we will see what is what Read my example above Edited December 8, 2022 by Gnasty 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 1 minute ago, Gnasty said: Where I'm coming from? It means I can see from your point of view/perspective. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wisdom Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 1 hour ago, rayun said: I think it would qualify as part of "quality of life". Anyways soon we will see what is what Do you get any kind of advantage with real money? Yes? Then it's pay to win. Farming faster because you spent real money is P2W. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleRose Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 P2W means you're getting a stat advantage for pvp. That's stuff like buying stat passives and safe refines. The devs have clearly said these things won't be in the game. Rose never has the situation where there is just one spawn of one king up for grabs and the only way to get it is through tele tickets. Even when there's only a couple of a king's spawn, people get their drop and move on. Substituting money for time isn't always P2W. If you go slippery slope on P2W all the way to everything but costumes being P2W, then people who have money they're willing to pay but not much time are just going to play a different game. By the logic of "any kind of advantage" you could even argue costumes are P2W because a top clan might think your character looks cooler than the free to play pleb or wants to befriend you because you're rich. It's too nebulous a term. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vile Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 Pay to Win: "Using real-money transactions officially or unofficially to purchase advantages over players who otherwise won't have access to the same advantages." If you spend money, and it gives you an advantage that doesn't exist any other way in-game, it's by definition pay to win. Has no specifics about making money/currency, pvp or pve, dungeons, crafting or anything else. If you pay for it, and there is no achievable way to replicate it in the base game, it's a paid advantage. As for what I think it matters. Paid convenience, like teleport tickets, level boosts/exp boosts, so forth only matter AFTER the first week or two the game is out [month for slower progressing games] because those would invalidate any racing or initial natural gains. Though I would strongly caution against the excess implementation of those, lest you forget how Triggersoft, Gravity and Warpportal started to ruin their product. You have 3 perfectly good examples of what not to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleRose Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 Just now, OwlchemistVile said: Pay to Win: "Using real-money transactions officially or unofficially to purchase advantages over players who otherwise won't have access to the same advantages." If you spend money, and it gives you an advantage that doesn't exist any other way in-game, it's by definition pay to win. Has no specifics about making money/currency, pvp or pve, dungeons, crafting or anything else. If you pay for it, and there is no achievable way to replicate it in the base game, it's a paid advantage. As for what I think it matters. Paid convenience, like teleport tickets, level boosts/exp boosts, so forth only matter AFTER the first week or two the game is out [month for slower progressing games] because those would invalidate any racing or initial natural gains. Though I would strongly caution against the excess implementation of those, lest you forget how Triggersoft, Gravity and Warpportal started to ruin their product. You have 3 perfectly good examples of what not to do. An otherwise unattainable advantage is the right way to put it. We need to talk about difference in kind, not difference in degree. Anything can be misconstrued into P2W if we go by degree. Refining had such terrible odds wise that you couldn't feasibly get maxed out gear, so the person buying plutorunes had an unfair power boost. You could then say fast travel is an unattainable advantage early on because players won't have enough time to have made a movement speed set. That effect then goes away over time. On the other hand, it might not actually be an advantage because players likely will not be strong enough to kill some important boss right at the start of the game. Gravity's problem was it just milked Rose. The moment the cost of running the game was going to go up to comply with European law changes, Gravity axed Europe and that killed the game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uliche Posted December 9, 2022 Share Posted December 9, 2022 @avatar and whoever else what i meant was more for only premium players. you pay for the extra convenience i guess. it is standard on mostly all games i played. there needs to be a hook to keep that revenue going for bills to pay for the content providers. i only know that luna had such portals in that city of eucar i think. but yah if you did a quest or as you said as long as you travel there it would unlocked a waypoint as a shortcut next time you want to go back without the boat trip or need of a scroll. sure it be for everyone So funny that this definition of pay to win is exactly what I meant for my thread. As it means different things for everyone. Where does someone stand if they have more playtime hours than someone else? P2w? Obviously there is money involve in their life to stay home - they are in the internet on a pc playing for hours, while others work and other life things to do but play less. Do we just market the player that plays the most or do we include everyone else that's why i posted my Character Auction suggestion just to plug it in. The portals are inferior to the ticket @HoneyBuns mentioned, tickets to get somewhere quicker from anywhere you are, specially if there is an event boss in kenji and you can tele from oro instantly or do quest a lot quicker with them. i can understand it there as p2w because we can't teleport from oro using a junon scroll but only during early release only real money can get you these advantage items- and these events are happening, sure i see it unfair. but it isnt fair that those not online can not make it. so what do you do? build a Portal! different time zones, different Hotpoint and all that because there may be less players. so your portal idea has much potential @rayun keep it up! its early release so later on when everyone has them and we are all rich is it any longer pay to win? they are available for everyone. so i guess its no longer p2w that is just a time thing and what is time?? MONEY Lol things just circle back, such a recycling thing p2w. but no one can take your bragging rights for not using those items. i will respect anyone for taking such a challenge of not using any means of pay to win. hardcore tournament servers for this rose online? 4 hours of game time as soon as you logging how far can you go! another suggestion idk im here to have fun and the idea that if the portals were for everyone in big city's like there are in Luna that be cool to find in Junon, eldeon and the other planets. as long as there is a portal to get back or a scroll. if there is a portal it should be safe zone. otherwise there will be a lot of dead players xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts