Bring back Muse/Cleric Buffs

[Cam Rellim]

Everything aside, all I want is an alternative to needing 4 people for a full powered buff. This does not mean give clerics their buffs back.  I don't think there should be a system in the game that makes an individual stronger barriered behind a party of 4 people. It invites unfair play for people, in certain situations, that can not find a party to buff them.  

Edited January 20, 2023 by Cam Rellim

[Avatar]

45 minutes ago, Cam Rellim said:

Everything aside, all I want is an alternative to needing 4 people for a full powered buff. This does not mean give clerics their buffs back.  I don't think there should be a system in the game that makes an individual stronger barriered behind a party of 4 people. It invites unfair play for people, in certain situations, that can not find a party to buff them.  

An alternative already exists, as stated previously. Buff potions exist. They’re crafted by dealer/artisans. 

You don’t need all the buffs to level up with ease as once you did. 

[Cam Rellim]

59 minutes ago, Avatar said:

An alternative already exists, as stated previously. Buff potions exist. They’re crafted by dealer/artisans. 

You don’t need all the buffs to level up with ease as once you did

Are these buffs just as good as getting one from a party full of max level characters? If so then we just move from clerics to dealers as the primary buff givers. I've already said I like the feel of leveling up not needing to worry about a buff. Maybe you don't fully understand what I'm trying to ask. Its the end game that has my attention. Seeing how the games plays, there's no way I'm going to solo farm, not worried about leveling this system seems fine. I also thought that it might not be possible on other servers until getting max buffs. Is the solo end game as I knew it dead because buffs are not as powerful, not because I can't get a full buff from a cleric. 

[Avatar]

1 hour ago, Cam Rellim said:

Are these buffs just as good as getting one from a party full of max level characters? If so then we just move from clerics to dealers as the primary buff givers. I've already said I like the feel of leveling up not needing to worry about a buff. Maybe you don't fully understand what I'm trying to ask. Its the end game that has my attention. Seeing how the games plays, there's no way I'm going to solo farm, not worried about leveling this system seems fine. I also thought that it might not be possible on other servers until getting max buffs. Is the solo end game as I knew it dead because buffs are not as powerful, not because I can't get a full buff from a cleric. 

No, potions aren’t as good as receiving the buffs from players themselves. Their potency is somewhere in between the basic and max % of what players can give, I believe. 

[Cam Rellim]

15 minutes ago, Avatar said:

No, potions aren’t as good as receiving the buffs from players themselves. Their potency is somewhere in between the basic and max % of what players can give. 

Well then, I guess I need to get to said end game and give them a try. I'm finding out that there are many more things different, other than buffs, about this game than the one I was used to. Like mobs dropping no matter how much higher of a level you are than them. I apologize, you'll have to excuse me for not doing more research first. I can tell you're a pretty fart smella, so I assume you deduced that I ran out of posts for the day on the op account and moved to this. 

Edited January 20, 2023 by Cam Rellim

[Lulullaby]

 

 

On 1/20/2023 at 2:03 AM, merc2 said:

Not really the point, so ill just edit it out. The point is that the whoopie will whop you with ease.

 

Answer this for me. I've been playing on three chars at the same time. Arti and raider on desktop and cleric on laptop. Its almost easier and more enjoyable, even with the weird dual client delay thing, with two clients auto attacking and the cleric healing to lvl up than it is on any one of those solo. Why is that? 

Very smart to say this from your Forum account from which mods can ban you because it's tied to your game account :')

That's bannable

[VeryScary]

I feel that this is a good topic for discussion, but I'm not sure that devs want to deviate from their current vision regarding this subject.

I'm not sure if anyone else has suggested this, and no one asked for my opinion... But personally, having played a lot of different versions of ROSE over the years (albeit casually) - I propose that it could be worth considering that the player could choose how they want to build / use their cleric, going forwards. By giving the full set of buffs back to clerics - but also giving the specific buffs to other classes, as has been done.
(Maybe class-specific buffs have improved max stat bonus as compared to those of clerics?)

This opens up 2 paths:
1. Some players may opt to dump all of their skill points into making a buff slave cleric account, effectively creating a buff-only account - offering themselves the ability to buff and grind solo while playing with two clients.
2. Other players who prefer a battle cleric with this hybrid playstyle, can invest in their offensive skills, join parties, sharing the available buffs from other classes and/or party members.

This flexibility not only offers the current gameplay mechanics, but also maintains original playstyles, to better suit the community's different preferences.

Entirely removing the playstyle of a buff + healer may be seen as too great a detriment to those players who seek to play ROSE for that specific nostalgia factor. Such changes to core gameplay could deter those players away from the official server, and drive them to find an applicable private server. Negatively impacting the player base count on official.

With this said, I have to go read and catch up on the previous threads which have already been discussing this issue!

EDIT: Also, OP, merc2,
What do you want to see in regards to changes? What do you want to see discussed here in this topic?

Edited January 25, 2023 by VeryScary

[merc2]

On 1/23/2023 at 3:58 PM, Lulullaby said:

Very smart to say this from your Forum account from which mods can ban you because it's tied to your game account :')

That's bannable

I went to the website to make an account, downloaded the game and started playing. No where did I see that you can't play on three clients. I said that I didn't know it was a rule and I have no problem following it. That being said, they obviously need a better way of telling people about this rule before issuing bans for it. Although, in my case it would be hard to prove that I'm on three clients. Considering four people in my house are playing the game and we are sharing a cleric that we have up on a laptop. You think I should get banned if I'm vending on one client while leveling on the second, and occasionally being the one to hit the heal or lay a bonfire down?

 

13 hours ago, VeryScary said:

What do you want to see in regards to changes? What do you want to see discussed here in this topic?

In terms of changes there's really only one thing I want. Full powered buffs, with out needing to be in a party with three other people. I don't want to discuss this topic. My topic was just buffs, but that got taken as bring back cleric buffs and the topic was changed/merged. I don't care how I get my buff or even if there are buffs. If full buffs are to exist then I just want to be able to give one to myself, and not a weaker buff. If Bill, Bob, Bobbybill, and Billybob get 69 more movement speed from their party buff, then I want a buff potion that gives me 69 not 68. 

[IceMaverick13]

Just found the game and started playing again after having such good memories of it from when I was younger.
Only made it to like level 20 in my first day of playing this new reboot, but was already working towards rebuilding my FS Cleric that I ran as a kid.

I feel like I genuinely have no idea what to do in this game now that I've found out FS Clerics have like half of the utility that they used to. Some of my fondest memories of the game were just running through the starting area and applying Buffs to everyone I walked past. Met a lot of cool people and had a really great social experience helping people who were new to the game or just making new characters. Some of the greatest feelings was walking into early-game areas that don't have a lot of Clerics hanging around and seeing just how happy everyone would be that somebody came through to give them buffs and help them along their way. 

I came to the forums just now to ask if they've removed the ability to Buff non-party members - because I wanted to start recreating my experiences of helping everyone that I pass - only to find out that they not only removed that, but also removed the most sought-after buffs that people used to seek out FS Clerics for in favor of putting them on other classes. I feel like I have to rethink my whole character. I'm considering completely scrapping this character and taking a completely different job instead.

I'm sure that somebody reviewed these changes and determined that they're healthy for the game's "meta" and have likely come with accompanying changes to support the paradigm shift, but it's deeply disappointing to me that the aspect of the game that I found most fun - helping new or low leveled players with tangible in-game benefits - just doesn't seem to be a thing I'm allowed to do anymore unless I want to like multi-box a roaming horde of 4 buff-centric characters (which also seems to be against TOS reading through here). But even then, with the removal of target-character buffs in favor of party-buffs, I can't even really do that either. 

I was never a "meta" player and rarely found enjoyment in running end-game content in the original lifespan of the game. For me, it was the social experience of playing with people and shooting the breeze with people from all over while groups of randoms came to sit around the bonfire and get their buffs. 

Ultimately, I think I'm just disappointed that the way I had my fun in Rose is just... not a supported way to play the game anymore. I was so excited when I saw that the game had been rebooted and was ready to recapture those old days. It's perhaps just a sign of growing older and realizing that the game you used to love isn't really made to support players like me anymore.

Edited January 29, 2023 by IceMaverick13

[-POSB-]

For ppl who keep saying "there are buff potion crafted by Arte/Dealer" pls stop i gt no zulie to buy them!!!! Nt like they are selling at 1k zulie ea! 

[LadyWasky]

On 1/2/2023 at 8:00 PM, merc2 said:

Also cleric feels like the same thing, just with out its buffs. Now its just an afk healer pressing 2 buttons? 

I have a Battle Cleric lvl 103 and I can solo when I want, what I want without any problem. And I enjoy parties as an active killer as well as I can support my party members efficiently.
You willl have all the fun you want if you know how to choose your stats/skills wisely, but it requires to think a bit about your build.
You are soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo wrong.

[merc2]

3 hours ago, LadyWasky said:

I have a Battle Cleric lvl 103

Battle Cleric isn't new, its probably worse now than it used to be. Imagine being a Battle Cleric with full buffs for pvp. I don't care about cleric, just pointed out a couple things. I only care about buffs. Actually starting to get irritated that the topic still says to bring back cleric buffs. I never said I wanted that, its like putting words in my mouth. Mod changed the topic, now everyone comes to the thread thinking that's what I want. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by merc2

[Avatar]

13 minutes ago, merc2 said:

Battle Cleric isn't new, its probably worse now than it used to be. Imagine being a Battle Cleric with full buffs for pvp. I don't care about cleric, just pointed out a couple things. I only care about buffs. Actually starting to get irritated that the topic still says to bring back cleric buffs. I never said I wanted that, its like putting words in my mouth. Mod changed the topic, now everyone comes to the thread thinking that's what I want. 

I've already asked you what you wanted it changed to lol. I'm still open to changing the topic name for whatever you want. In the end, however, I still think you're going to receive the same responses as that is the majority's impression of this post are.

[merc2]

1 hour ago, Avatar said:

In the end, however, I still think you're going to receive the same responses as that is the majority's impression of this post are.

 

I agree. Everyone wants to talk about cleric, instead of just the buffs. I have no ill feelings towards you, not even mad that you changed the topic. Just started to get tired of seeing cleric this and cleric that. I'm only replying because of the tags and notifications. I had done very little research before posting originally, now that post is just a thorn in my side. If I could rewrite it, I wouldn't mention Clerics. I would say that I just want access to buffs without a party. So maybe the topic would be party buffs or something along those lines. that being said, you've answered that. So honestly, I'm pretty much done talking about it anyway. Just planning on going with the flow and seeing how it turns out in the end. Seeing how the game plays, the decisions about cleric and buffs aren't going to be detrimental to me playing or not. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by merc2

[Bobbity]

In the current state of the game the following is true: artisans can craft buff potions. Dealers can't. In fact, good luck trying to craft a buff potion at level 120. Spoiler: It's not going to happen without Arua's intervention.

In the spirit of giving people options AND earning things through hard work and gumption, I don't see any reason why valor quests can't reward buff potions as well AND/OR valor shops have buff potions available for sale. This would mirror what's available in the Honor shop.

 

I've been thinking about ways to bring back targeted buffs as well as ritual skills without breaking the current meta. So far, this seems impossible. That said, there's nothing that says the meta is sacred and inviolable. We can bring back targeted buffs as long as it's not core to the current skill tree. Also, although I tend to dismiss pserver-ish things, we could have Junon Order NPCs (and those from Luxem Tower) provide some buffs. Free? I dunno. It's something to think about. At least it's not a buff fairy.

[Evylrune]

So, are they going to give every class the ability to craft so we don't need to look for an artisan? I think it's the next logical step.

[Aquil]

For me, the best would be to remove all the buffs (they are annoying u have to recast them from time to time) and just raise some passives power ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[LordAlbion]

11 minutes ago, Aquil said:

For me, the best would be to remove all the buffs (they are annoying u have to recast them from time to time) and just raise some passives power ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Just, no.

[HealTheWorld]

On 1/11/2023 at 11:32 AM, darkvader said:

follow the path quest 1st get the armor set that gives 10% exp bonus.

5

What is that quest called to get that 10%? and where do u get it? Thanks.

[Sparky]

See Stephano in Anima Lake

[Bobbity]

8 hours ago, Evylrune said:

So, are they going to give every class the ability to craft so we don't need to look for an artisan? I think it's the next logical step.

I don't mind some basic level of crafting for necessities on other classes. Skill points and stats aren't free, after all, so you always pay for having this additional ability. A scout learning to fletch arrows will never threaten the livelihood of a well-equipped artisan working at an economy of scale.

 

6 hours ago, Aquil said:

For me, the best would be to remove all the buffs (they are annoying u have to recast them from time to time) and just raise some passives power ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Buffs are what makes Rose stand out, so we're unlikely to get rid of them, but we've already moved in the direction of making passives more important. Many of the Unique skills focus on passives more than buffs.  Remember, most buffs are party buffs - if you're not in a party, you don't need them. Since they're so tightly bound with player experience throughout the game, they have high priority with the devs, so I expect we'll eventually come to a workable compromise. 

[Kayuchi]

14 hours ago, Evylrune said:

So, are they going to give every class the ability to craft so we don't need to look for an artisan? I think it's the next logical step.

Agreed. Make it possible at npc's.

Most arti's are always busy, and some even ask 500k to craft something.

[Sumbudy]

1 hour ago, Kayuchi said:

Agreed. Make it possible at npc's.

Most arti's are always busy, and some even ask 500k to craft something.

Thats the business moto. Demand plays a big part in any market. Is it greedy? sure. However they are also providing their services.

[Kayuchi]

I get that, but buff potions are a solution for everyone after cleric buffs got diverted between classes. Shouldt be behind a pay wall, because some are greedy.

[Bobbity]

But that's literally how economies work... stuff exists behind paywalls. I mean, you can play a game without economies, without currencies, without demand because supply is infinite. This is fine and is called a trash pserver. You can get any cosmetic you want, any skill you want. All you need is a good relationship with the server admin.

A compromise would be to get dealer buffs and buff pots from Ferrel Guild quests, muse buffs and buff pots from the Arumics, soldier and hawker buffs and buff pots from the Righteous Crusaders and the ability to buy them for Valor from the Valor shops at the Junon Order.

 

EDIT: With more questlines guiding players from Adventurer's Plains to Junon (free weapons etc.) and beyond, I feel handing out 2 or 3 buff potions for your own class at the starter village could do wonders in making players addicted to them. They could be part of the class assumption rewards, the Jelly King quest rewards or even the rewards from talking to the mayor in Junon.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Bobbity
Buh-LESSINGuh! KonoSuba!