CLERIC TO SURVIVE THE GAME?

[Critpeak]

Indeed, I remember my pc started to struggle a bit when I open 8 clients.

[LordAlbion]

On 11/22/2022 at 8:56 AM, Maddox said:

Do we still need one cleric on another account besides our main account to survive the game? since on my last experience of playing it is necessary to have a cleric account to play solo, i hope this time will be more focused on partying with clerics and not making your own just to survive solo leveling i hope the we can level decent and farm without the need of your own cleric as a second account. 

You never "NEEDED" a cleric to lvl. It was faster, yes, but def not needed. And I as well as many other clerics would spend alot of time going around and buffing people. That was fun!

[Majestic]

7 hours ago, LordAlbion said:

You never "NEEDED" a cleric to lvl. It was faster, yes, but def not needed. And I as well as many other clerics would spend alot of time going around and buffing people. That was fun!

im really struggle with people that keep saying "needed needed it was forced to open a cleric"
no, no one pointed a gun to you
and you can perfectly clear the game and go level 250 without a cleric
cause there was always a party spot everywhere with a cleric in party to buff you and u just needed to attack
cleric was everywhere and you didn't need to open one for yourself to level up cuz there is someone else with a cleric just buffing you up if its on side on group or in party
and now what i can really see its going downwards and muse will be stuck at level 100 cuz his second job was focus on buff and now he doesn't have those abilities
and probably will be neglected

[Ashura]

On 12/5/2022 at 3:33 AM, Majestic said:

bro official its official and should never change like a pserver
and  thats total BS to say they want socializing.... when i was a buff slave i was always Socializing how bout that bro??
i was always looking for someone to help and talk i was always welcomed to a party
and even if someone had a cleric in party he would take his cleric out and invite my cleric
no one was selfish everyone was nice! and we always making new friends CLASSES HAE NOTHING TO DO TO THE GAME ISSUE!
LEAVE CLERIC ALONE I WAS HAVING A GREAT TIME WITH IT AS IT IS
its not a pserver for it to change so much from the original and bend the crap out of the game
there was a uniqueness and beauty as it was.... refine is needed yes improvements adding content fixing issues bugs
but not changing the whole secnery sir... and whole meta by remove the most important buffs and make him so useless and now in pursue after all classes just for been buff
its out of the question

just look at other people mind and commenting on this!

"It was awesome being able to stack up your friends to help with leveling progression. But without their buffing tools they become a heal bot. /:

I understand the switch to making them more active party members, but that changes their function into basically a second mage which I think is redundant  Its kind of deterring me from playing the game when it releases again. "

"Ive read a few points on this, and id be sad to see the clerics identity completely changed, making the cleric basically mage 2.0."

"And now it's return have been announced, only for me to be disappointed by such an extreme change in classes, which doesn't feel like rose anymore.

Cleric is a support class, and should remain as such. "

"If you remove that from the game - there will be a significant portion of players who either won't be able to enjoy that part of the game, or won't be able to contribute for that part of the game.

If this is going to be a long term project, changing parts of the game which have been like this for almost 20 years is not the solution - everyone who knows and have played this game at some point is used to classes as they are.

If you want to add something new - either add a completely new job/classes or add 3rd job which each class will be able to choose for themselves.

Another thing which will keep hardcore rose players is possibility to finally see what rose was meant to be, what the name stands for - rush on seven episodes. Slowly expanding rose world to all of it's planets, remodeling and expanding useless old features like castle gears per say. Enabling factions to have greater impact. 

There are plenty of paths which the game have left unexplored and untouched. 

Dividing the perks which single class has amongst the rest - will simply kill that class as a choose-to-play."

more and more comments like that from people that actually know something and loved the cleric!!
cleric is not a mage and this change going to kill his identity


need more honest comments?

As I am writing this there is so many things going through my mind as to what I want to say regarding this post and I do not have the time to write an entire essay on your post. 

I am a cleric main, actually I main all my characters I take the time to understand its pros and cons and build according to my liking of playing the class do I take a deep dive into the class and try and make the perfect build? No I don't because I have an actual life and family and friends that want my attention as well. The little time I do have to play I try and enjoy it as much as possible. This might sound rude to you but I am still going to say this. If you are opposed to what the team is doing then go play a pServer and complain about the dificiencies their server has because that is how it goes in every single version/server of the game. Better yet why don't you go to Gravity and make a proposition to them, have a roadmap handy to show them what your vision of the game should be. Who knows perhaps they will grant you permission to be in direct competition with these guys and maybe something far better will come out of it all. 

It's easy to say why don't you go this route that route with the game implement this and that make this or that, but where is the time to do all those things nevermind resources and staff to Jetstream it in let's say by the 13th of December when Rednim launched EA. Those are all things the devs have thought about and no matter how much you/we want to know how Rednim came about the license for the game. The only mistake I see the devs have made was announcing the return of Rose and didn't expect this much interest in it but that is also a very good thing it means they can grow and we as a community should help them grow. 

I hear what your concerns are and understand it all trust me I do, but please take time to listen to other opinions that do not align with yours, stop just throwing your toys of the cot. You want the devs to respect your concerns and wishes so do the same. Play the game and decide afterwards, don't just be part of the heard and just shout without thinking things through I am sure if you want the devs to explain why the changes and what their ideas are behind it all they will take the time to explain and if you don't like it decide what is the best course of action for yourself. 

I read in discord how a select few are trying to question the legitimacy of the team and question their ability to handle the project. (Major gaming companies take years making a game with bigger staff and deeper pockets and still fail). Give them time to prove you right or better yet give them time to prove you WRONG. The few changes they have made already shows that they care about the game. 

Sorry Bobbity for the lack of grammar in this post. 

[TheShredr]

One final comment from me on the cleric buff situation:

1. Some of you fail to see that if one class have all the power in buffing other chars, and you need those buffs for max efficiency, people are 'forced' to level one and build that character for the full support build. If you don't do this, you are reliant on the availability of others, which over the years have been proven that most people do not like if there is another option available.

2. At least in the current situation no single class has all the buffs, and by the client max of 2 you are forced to play together with others if you want all buffs.

Regardless of the changes I still think the problem of 'AFK solely build characters for buffing' is still there, I would love to see a solution for that as well.

PS: Please don't repond to this with 'but you just destroyed the sole purpose of the cleric, we need revert', we know this by now.

[Majestic]

32 minutes ago, Ashura said:

As I am writing this there is so many things going through my mind as to what I want to say regarding this post and I do not have the time to write an entire essay on your post. 

I am a cleric main, actually I main all my characters I take the time to understand its pros and cons and build according to my liking of playing the class do I take a deep dive into the class and try and make the perfect build? No I don't because I have an actual life and family and friends that want my attention as well. The little time I do have to play I try and enjoy it as much as possible. This might sound rude to you but I am still going to say this. If you are opposed to what the team is doing then go play a pServer and complain about the dificiencies their server has because that is how it goes in every single version/server of the game. Better yet why don't you go to Gravity and make a proposition to them, have a roadmap handy to show them what your vision of the game should be. Who knows perhaps they will grant you permission to be in direct competition with these guys and maybe something far better will come out of it all. 

It's easy to say why don't you go this route that route with the game implement this and that make this or that, but where is the time to do all those things nevermind resources and staff to Jetstream it in let's say by the 13th of December when Rednim launched EA. Those are all things the devs have thought about and no matter how much you/we want to know how Rednim came about the license for the game. The only mistake I see the devs have made was announcing the return of Rose and didn't expect this much interest in it but that is also a very good thing it means they can grow and we as a community should help them grow. 

I hear what your concerns are and understand it all trust me I do, but please take time to listen to other opinions that do not align with yours, stop just throwing your toys of the cot. You want the devs to respect your concerns and wishes so do the same. Play the game and decide afterwards, don't just be part of the heard and just shout without thinking things through I am sure if you want the devs to explain why the changes and what their ideas are behind it all they will take the time to explain and if you don't like it decide what is the best course of action for yourself. 

I read in discord how a select few are trying to question the legitimacy of the team and question their ability to handle the project. (Major gaming companies take years making a game with bigger staff and deeper pockets and still fail). Give them time to prove you right or better yet give them time to prove you WRONG. The few changes they have made already shows that they care about the game. 

Sorry Bobbity for the lack of grammar in this post. 

nothing is easy my friend.... but its far too easy not to mess with classes that doesn't need a revamp
and hurt the other side of player that do like cleric as it is sir... to buff heal and now he is just a doll of healing bot
what would u do after second job without buffs?? been mage 2.0?? cuz u only left with attack skills and heal right??
so what would u do my friend?
why removing an essential part of what cleric is just to please some angry rants "buff slave" people and hurt other players
this is not the solution bro
its not too hard to comprehand and understand that remvoing buffs is a BIG MISTAKE and not close to a solution about slaves

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[asaa]

Guys, 

Buffs getting spread out throughout the classes will only be great at launch when there is a ton of players at each level range to party up with. It will be easy to find different classes because it’s launch and everyone is playing different classes.
 

But what about later on? There will be a time when every party is going to be missing a specific class in order to be fully buffed. People will get too far ahead of the pack in leveling or fall too far behind. What if you’re alone in an area, how are you going to buff up? You will have SLOW, painful progress.

Spreading out buffs or having clerics posses all the buffs lead to a big issue of making the game scale around buffed characters/parties. 

My suggestions are either to remove buffs completely and scale the game without buffs or to make all the buffs become consumables which can be easily available to all classes on demand (bought from an npc).

To counter the cleric’s uselessness, all you have to do is add content that requires ACTIVE healing. Like adding group activities (dungeons) which require clerics to make sure the party stays alive, and are otherwise unclear-able if you don’t have capable healers.
 

You can make it even more interesting and give clerics more support skills like protection bubbles and healing over time skills, etc etc. That would keep clerics on their toes while partying up (not just stand still and buff) and also keep their demand high for partying.

[Majestic]

5 minutes ago, X15 said:

Guys, 

Buffs getting spread out throughout the classes will only be great at launch when there is a ton of players at each level range to party up with. It will be easy to find different classes because it’s launch and everyone is playing different classes.
 

But what about later on? There will be a time when every party is going to be missing a specific class in order to be fully buffed. People will get too far ahead of the pack in leveling or fall too far behind. What if you’re alone in an area, how are you going to buff up? You will have SLOW, painful progress.

Spreading out buffs or having clerics posses all the buffs lead to a big issue of making the game scale around buffed characters/parties. 

My suggestions are either to remove buffs completely and scale the game without buffs or to make all the buffs become consumables which can be easily available to all classes on demand (bought from an npc).

To counter the cleric’s uselessness, all you have to do is add content that requires ACTIVE healing. Like adding group activities (dungeons) which require clerics to make sure the party stays alive, and are otherwise unclear-able if you don’t have capable healers.
 

You can make it even more interesting and give clerics more support skills like protection bubbles and healing over time skills, etc etc. That would keep clerics on their toes while partying up (not just stand still and buff) and also keep their demand high for partying.

i can support and agree on that
dont neglect cleric and just say we are removing his buffs and thats it thats the final build
cuz his whole thing was to support and without buffs he only left to be healer bot and i hate it deeply!
but if you remove all buffs from all classes and give cleric other skills to support besides healing thats ok and im all for it.... dont leave us just to heal its boring and not unique
that means u need to balance a bit the movement speed and attack speed this most important
cuz im not gonna chase after hawker everytime i need speed and im not going to chase artisan for buff potions when before i could do that on my own with my cleric

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[asaa]

5 minutes ago, X15 said:

Guys, 

Buffs getting spread out throughout the classes will only be great at launch when there is a ton of players at each level range to party up with. It will be easy to find different classes because it’s launch and everyone is playing different classes.
 

But what about later on? There will be a time when every party is going to be missing a specific class in order to be fully buffed. People will get too far ahead of the pack in leveling or fall too far behind. What if you’re alone in an area, how are you going to buff up? You will have SLOW, painful progress.

Spreading out buffs or having clerics posses all the buffs lead to a big issue of making the game scale around buffed characters/parties. 

My suggestions are either to remove buffs completely and scale the game without buffs or to make all the buffs become consumables which can be easily available to all classes on demand (bought from an npc).

To counter the cleric’s uselessness, all you have to do is add content that requires ACTIVE healing. Like adding group activities (dungeons) which require clerics to make sure the party stays alive, and are otherwise unclear-able if you don’t have capable healers.
 

You can make it even more interesting and give clerics more support skills like protection bubbles and healing over time skills, etc etc. That would keep clerics on their toes while partying up (not just stand still and buff) and also keep their demand high for partying.

Also, won’t some classes benefit more from their class buffs in a 1v1 PvP scenario? What will a champion with str and hp buffs do against a raider with dodge buffs? 

[asaa]

3 minutes ago, Majestic said:

i can support and agree on that
dont neglect cleric and just say we are removing his buffs and thats it thats the final build
cuz his whole thing was to support and without buffs he only left to be healer bot and i hate it deeply!
but if you remove all buffs from all classes and give cleric other skills to support besides healing thats ok and im all for it.... dont leave us just to heal its boring and not unique
that means u need to balance a bit the movement speed and attack speed this most important
cuz im not gonna chase after hawker everytime i need speed and im not going to chase artisan for buff potions when before i could do that on my own with my cleric

Standing still, spamming buffs every 5 minutes is worse than “heal bots”. Healing can be fun if you make it hard. Timing heals, dropping HoTs on time, keeping people alive under heavy damage/boss fights. But yes, adding new skills would be great although I don’t know how much work that is to add new skills.
 

Easiest thing to do is to just add hard, rewarding content that requires hardcore healing. That would make a cleric fun to play. Healing = Support. 

[TheShredr]

That is why we have to experience the current changes in de Early Access (which means not full release, since not all builds, changes, balance or w/e is final yet) and give feedback to the devs how to build upon the changes! They never stated that this would be the new purpose of cleric and that they won't improve it further.

[Majestic]

20 minutes ago, X15 said:

Standing still, spamming buffs every 5 minutes is worse than “heal bots”. Healing can be fun if you make it hard. Timing heals, dropping HoTs on time, keeping people alive under heavy damage/boss fights. But yes, adding new skills would be great although I don’t know how much work that is to add new skills.
 

Easiest thing to do is to just add hard, rewarding content that requires hardcore healing. That would make a cleric fun to play. Healing = Support. 

for you its worse sir... for everyone else that likes to buff its the whole world of fun to keep buff and heal and bonfire more things to do then just heal.... and on higher levels you just put lots of salamander and u dont even need to heal.... bruh pls understand the mess its going to cause
giving only 1 activity to do is worse then ever
and i liked buffing everyone and doing healing and maintain the party together
cleris is not just buff he is kinda leader
if you cant get it im sorry but i cant accept it

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[Vile]

The polls says 2 to 1 people are in favor of the changes going forward for testing and launching. Usually you can rely on the wisdom of the crowd. When it comes to activities people do for fun, usually you side with the biggest group of people who think the idea is fun. And the ones malding and filling their diaper won't ever be pleased, and are safe to ignore.

Vox populi vox Dei.

[Critpeak]

This is my last post in this forum, 

regarding everyone who want features from other games added, and crying about that they don't want to level a cleric because of this and that.

1. The whole game and every single monster above lvl 70 is build around cleric having it's core buffs.

2. Vouching for something you saw in another mmorpg is pitiful - this is ROSE, no need to add trash features from another game - if you want it just play that game, and leave rose to true ROSE players.

3. Current dismantle of cleric and redistribution it's buffs to other classes - makes pvp ONE SIDED and completely UNBALANCED.

4. Devs so far close all the topics considering cleric changes that majority of opinions is AGAINST their decision - which means nothing is going to change, they'll wait for people to reach 100-120-140lvl start complaining, go back to HOW IS MEANT TO BE, but by that time, most people will be bored and leave.

5. When you want to start a game which is supremely difficult to maintain, don't repeat the bad decisions which lead to it's end. 

- Changing something that is already there doesn't cut it - you have to bring something new, not remodeling, painting, and graphic change.

6. People who stream lvl 30muse with magician build -SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED to say that is easy to level a CLERIC, what they show it's nothing near the truth.

7. Everyone is laughing at private servers, but the truth is there are private servers, with a ton of people running for years - one specific server is running for 15 years, maybe you should check how far they've developed and build on top of that instead.

8. No matter what you are saying, taken upon your words, not having complete reset - this is the actual launch of the game, naming it early access is just a backup plan so you have something to say when you finally figured you screwed up - but considering that majority of players who play rose - have played it for decades, and know how things go - you probably won't have a second chance.

9. When you open forum for discussions - don't lock every topic that is not convenient to you, you either live with it or just don't waste peoples time.

Progress comes from criticism and pointing out mistakes - not from fake ass lickers. We have few people repeating same thing in the forum, just to oppose the opinions they don't like, no matter if they are backed up with facts. Both in forum and discord.

10. Good luck with this rosewanabee project, and big thanks to the team for the disappointment delivered, I'd rather return playing in a private server, than losing months of my time to some non sense. 

11. Have fun to all players - cleric oriented players - go for mage, magev2 sucks.

As for PVP oriented players - hawkers are the way to go, at least before they nerf them to "balance" the game.

[TheShredr]

I need to react to this, since you are not talking facts in some particular parts, and this really annoys me:

4 minutes ago, Critpeak said:

4. Devs so far close all the topics considering cleric changes that majority of opinions is AGAINST their decision - which means nothing is going to change, they'll wait for people to reach 100-120-140lvl start complaining, go back to HOW IS MEANT TO BE, but by that time, most people will be bored and leave.

5 minutes ago, Critpeak said:

9. When you open forum for discussions - don't lock every topic that is not convenient to you, you either live with it or just don't waste peoples time.

They are closing the topics because people are violating the rules in not respecting each other. Next to that, the vote they did close, was heavily in favor of supporting the way they go.

6 minutes ago, Critpeak said:

7. Everyone is laughing at private servers, but the truth is there are private servers, with a ton of people running for years - one specific server is running for 15 years, maybe you should check how far they've developed and build on top of that instead.

Yea, sir, heavily successful server with a messed up economy, people keep playing this because there is no good alternative and they have such amount of time invested already, hugely p2w features, should I go on?

Please get your facts straight before you post such and immense disrespectful post.

[Majestic]

32 minutes ago, TheShredr said:

I need to react to this, since you are not talking facts in some particular parts, and this really annoys me:

They are closing the topics because people are violating the rules in not respecting each other. Next to that, the vote they did close, was heavily in favor of supporting the way they go.

Yea, sir, heavily successful server with a messed up economy, people keep playing this because there is no good alternative and they have such amount of time invested already, hugely p2w features, should I go on?

Please get your facts straight before you post such and immense disrespectful post.

lets agree to disagree
the buffers in this forum even if its not the majority 50 against 30 and i bet not all the 1K in the discord saw this messed up change
if all the 1K will see this change and react i can bet you that most of them will be against this change Kapish?
we dont love this change and we feel the devs forcing us into this and the other hand just slap us and saying if you dont like our plan go play something else
gee thanks..... thanks for destroying all of our childhood fun game for mixed up classes when it was totally fine before
and the devs could do tons of other ideas that keeps cleric as it is and choose different idea without the need of removing anything
again we agree to disagree and only time will tell if this game survive like that and i wish the devs goodluck in that process i really hope for the best

PS. most people that voted no has like FAKE profile !!
without even one comment ... most of them are not even active profiles
so its not even accurate to say its 50

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[TheShredr]

You are betting quite a lot, upping the score from 23 to 30, reacting to my post while the majority of your reaction isn't on topic to what I was posting.

[Loerslang]

Unfortunatly this topic always leads to discussion with a light sprinkle of salt the very basic fact is; the change is made. Thats it. If it works, it will work, if it doesn’t work, the changes can be reverted.. thats the very basis of this constantly ongoing discussion. 

[Majestic]

3 minutes ago, TheShredr said:

You are betting quite a lot, upping the score from 23 to 30, reacting to my post while the majority of your reaction isn't on topic to what I was posting.

PS. most people that voted no has like FAKE profile !!
without even one comment ... most of them are not even active profiles
so its not even accurate to say its 50

ok i will create now 100 fake profile and vote YES for revert
broo most of those votes are faked!!
bring back all the OG player they wil tell you in your face its wrong move on cleric
the real OG

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[L3nn0x]

I don't think it was fine before though? You had to play with buffs on to be able to level up otherwise you'd just die & it'd take forever. So you had to level up a cleric at the same time, or have a friend playing cleric, or ask for buffs in Junon before going xp. You couldn't realistically play without a cleric. Our idea with the change was to make clerics less preponderant in the game. They're still required at high level in raids & dungeons, but you don't need to have one to level up as a casual player anymore.

Maybe it's not a good idea and we'll run a survey after EA starts to see how the community feels about the change, but we do want to change this buff-centric meta that's been running since forever in the game. As a casual player, you shouldn't have to dual account with a cleric.

[Majestic]

10 minutes ago, L3nn0x said:

I don't think it was fine before though? You had to play with buffs on to be able to level up otherwise you'd just die & it'd take forever. So you had to level up a cleric at the same time, or have a friend playing cleric, or ask for buffs in Junon before going xp. You couldn't realistically play without a cleric. Our idea with the change was to make clerics less preponderant in the game. They're still required at high level in raids & dungeons, but you don't need to have one to level up as a casual player anymore.

Maybe it's not a good idea and we'll run a survey after EA starts to see how the community feels about the change, but we do want to change this buff-centric meta that's been running since forever in the game.

and now you dont need to ask for buffs?
you need it even more and search for 4 different classes for buffs
you see me now chasing a hakwer for speed buff or attack speed?
what cleric have to do besides heal?? attack? its not a a fighter its a cleric supporter class and you made him out of mage sub class
sorryL3nn0x i dont like it
lots of players gave you lots of pointers of how bad it is and how bad its gonna be later on....
and i already said its not fair to us players the ones of other side that enjoyed been a buffer to cast us aside
basically you want to remove dual client and remove all buffs entirely
you can just change the gane name to ROZ online cuz its definitely not rose online if you give it a new face

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[Whoop]

13 minutes ago, Majestic said:

and now you dont need to ask for buffs?
you need it even more and search for 4 different classes for buffs
you see me now chasing a hakwer for speed buff or attack speed?
what cleric have to do besides heal?? attack? its not a a fighter its a cleric supporter class and you made him out of mage sub class
sorry leonox i dont like it
lots of players gave you lots of pointers of how bad it is and how bad its gonna be later on....

Maybe read his post a bit more carefully.... They are clearly open to changing it when it doesn't work out.

16 minutes ago, L3nn0x said:

Maybe it's not a good idea and we'll run a survey after EA starts to see how the community feels about the change, but we do want to change this buff-centric meta that's been running since forever in the game. As a casual player, you shouldn't have to dual account with a cleric.

 

Also there are always buff pots in the game to balance accordingly

Edited December 6, 2022 by Whoop

[Majestic]

4 minutes ago, Whoop said:

Maybe read his post a bit more carefully.... 

 

Also there are always buff pots in the game to balance accordingly

why i need to use buff pots sir when there is special class for it since day 1 cleric was made for it to help the party and buff them heal them support from the sidelines
why i need to rely on buff pots?
bro srsly its messed up and i just cant .... cant
wish all good luck for the devs but its not working for me at all

Edited December 6, 2022 by Majestic

[Whoop]

Just now, Majestic said:

why i need to us buff pots sir when there is special class for it since day 1 cleric was made for it to help the party and buff them heal them support from the sidelines
why i need to rely on buff pots?
bro srsly its messed up and i just cant .... cant
wish all good luck for the devs but its not working for me at all

Because you will be reliant on always needing a cleric for gameplay 

[Majestic]

Just now, Whoop said:

Because you will be reliant on always needing a cleric for gameplay 

thats what makes cleric wanted and welcomed
and bro i was a soldier before cleric
and i never had any problem to level up without a cleric
everyone in party used their on self buff and we manage perfectly
later on higer level yes we needed a cleric nothing wrong with that
cuz cleric buffs are effective only on higher levels 180-200
after u finish a bit to max the skills

and now everyone buffs?? ITS A JOKE MAN ITS A MESS