General Cleric change discussion

[asaa]

8 hours ago, Bobbity said:

It does depend on the champ, tbh (sword champ might do okay, spear champ would do reliable aoe dmg before dying, axe champ will either succeed with one crit or flail around uselessly) but very good point. The idea of distributed buffs relies on the idea of a party and doesn't work in 1v1. Maybe this is how it should be; I know that I'd expect to pwn an axe champ if I were a raider.

Somewhere on the forums I suggested some compromise between static buff play and more engaged active play using auras and other stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if the devs see the problem and are brainstorming a solution. After all, it's an obvious point of failure. 

I think they need to just remove all the buffs and scale the game without buffs so that you can play solo or party at anytime without the need of a cleric or other people for buffs.

There’s so many ways to “balance” buffs that it doesnt have to be the way it is. 
 

They can make a “pill” that you can buy from NPCs that give you 1 hour buffs upon consuming. Add an NPC in major city that gives out 2 hour, city-wide buffs every couple minutes. Or just remove buffs altogether and scale the game without buffs. Removing all the buffs will allow for friendlier solo play, as well as team play. 

[lazypenguin]

Artisans can craft buff pots

[Vile]

6 hours ago, lazypenguin said:

Artisans can craft buff pots

Yeh, that's what I said.

[SteveOmaha]

Definitely buy your buffs from Artis

[LordAlbion]

On 6/6/2022 at 1:59 PM, Wondertje said:

Wouldn't leaving Clerics the way they were (old school f/s buffers) and add class boosts for single player characters be what everyone wants? If you want to play solo - you have your class buffs. If you want to play in team, one can be a f/s, one could be not (just make sure the buffs don't stack), and if you want to do multi-client you can do that too. That way literally everyone can get basic buffs for themselves, and are still encouraged to play in teams at higher levels.

This post was not given enough attention IMHO.

[Vile]

1 hour ago, LordAlbion said:

This post was not given enough attention IMHO.

It was ignored because the buffs were added to all classes before NA even shut down. The only new change was Cleric not having all defensive and offensive buffs. [News flash, Clerics were still fine in NA as BC's and Healers/War Clerics, so they'll probably survive just fine with the new changes and after Rednim upgrades their healing activity kit]

[LordAlbion]

2 hours ago, OwlchemistVile said:

It was ignored because the buffs were added to all classes before NA even shut down. The only new change was Cleric not having all defensive and offensive buffs. [News flash, Clerics were still fine in NA as BC's and Healers/War Clerics, so they'll probably survive just fine with the new changes and after Rednim upgrades their healing activity kit]

 

Thats why YOU ignored it.  You seem to be very arrogant, for no apparent reason. News flash, settle down.

I still think her Idea is a good one, and I hope the dev team considers it down the road.

[Vile]

Congratulations. You did the thing that derails every topic every time. You try to pick an emotional fight and argue with feelings. What I stated as fact is true. I didn't even imply my own opinion of the changes at all. Stating how things happened isn't an emotional point being taken, it's stating history. Good grief. Everyone is so quick to be mad.

[Bobbity]

4 hours ago, LordAlbion said:

This post was not given enough attention IMHO.

The suggestion post from @TheShredr explored this more, of course. Rose Online is in an awkward position right now of being overly reliant on the nostalgia factor for its initial playerbase while trying to create a sustainable inflow of new players. I'll assume the devs will figure out some decent compromises after (or during?) EA so nostalgic players still feel like they're doing what they used to do and getting the same emotional gratification.  The problem is the game needs a lot of work.

[SteveOmaha]

December 13, 2022 1pm EST...

[Gamb]

I come here after the seing a muse with no buffs

Just answer me a tiny question... What will do a newbie player in 1 month when there will be literally no one at his level to party with?. because Class-buffs will force people to main a character in order to be at range for potential players to party with

[Driz]

yes it might be a great idea to change the cleric. but for sure the old cleric is far better than changing it. not everone is playing with party all the time. Specially when they want to farm/hunt item on their own, its really pain in the ass if they have incomplete buffs to do that farming/hunting. it might some player quite early or not play this game anymore. Because

this is not the same game they played before... just my opinion.

[Archtog]

I played an active "war" Cleric (as Sane Butler) in a party, regularly back in 2010-2013 ish.
I found that having the active heals and well timed cleanse or mute was extremely helpful for group pvp.

During the first 3v3 tournament the teams that made it the furthest all had clerics. That's some pretty good representation.
Honestly, I don't understand the decision to remove some buffs from clerics to prevent Buffslaves.

If the aim is for more people playing cleric, removing buff slave incentive just makes fewer people have a max level cleric. This raises the barrier to people playing an active cleric role.

With that said I don't think removing the buffs will hurt the endgame use of a cleric. I always played a fast m-speed cleric with decent defensive stats and used buffs, rarely, when I saw someone had been buff stripped. 

This change simply will give less incentive for people to make a max level cleric in general. If the buffs still calculate how i remember, my biggest worry is that we'll end up with buff slaves of each class which will just add to the complexity of buffing the party up.

I didn't play as much Cleric after the skills overhaul so this opinion may be dated a bit, however I believe it still applies.

[Vile]

The aim was to reduce the number of people playing Clerics, only to drag them around for buffs. Not to reduce the number of active mains. When you have a system that tells EVERYONE they need to have a personal cleric at all times just in case, it's not optional, it's mandatory.

That's what they want to remove. Let the people play it who want to actively play it. Remove the over-bearing incentive to have every single player make a personal cleric.

[Archtog]

On 12/6/2022 at 1:05 PM, X15 said:

I think they need to just remove all the buffs and scale the game without buffs so that you can play solo or party at anytime without the need of a cleric or other people for buffs.

There’s so many ways to “balance” buffs that it doesnt have to be the way it is. 
 

They can make a “pill” that you can buy from NPCs that give you 1 hour buffs upon consuming. Add an NPC in major city that gives out 2 hour, city-wide buffs every couple minutes. Or just remove buffs altogether and scale the game without buffs. Removing all the buffs will allow for friendlier solo play, as well as team play. 

Removing buffs is an interesting idea and definitely simpler. I'm curious what that would look like, but I think it wouldn't be ROSE. Perhaps some endgame modes that prohibit buffs could be fun. Game modes that have different styles of team play, like how the crystal defender disallowed food. It didn't change the leveling process, just the endgame.

[hjvg]

9 minutes ago, Archtog said:

With that said I don't think removing the buffs will hurt the endgame use of a cleric. I always played a fast m-speed cleric with decent defensive stats and used buffs, rarely, when I saw someone had been buff stripped. 

This change simply will give less incentive for people to make a max level cleric in general. If the buffs still calculate how i remember, my biggest worry is that we'll end up with buff slaves of each class which will just add to the complexity of buffing the party up.

I didn't play as much Cleric after the skills overhaul so this opinion may be dated a bit, however I believe it still applies.

ATM you will need int and charm on your cleric to give the best heal (buffs that cleric still got) so nu much room to add a lot of dex to get speed and you need a reaider to get your mspeedbuff

1 minute ago, OwlchemistVile said:

That's what they want to remove. Let the people play it who want to actively play it. Remove the over-bearing incentive to have every single player make a personal cleric.

buffs are not removed to the game they are splitted to all classes so now you need not 1 char but all classes to get full buffs

[Gamb]

As i said, this change looks ok to all players that starts today. But next week when everybody will be at Luna. Who will party the few newcomers, or the casuals that are underlevel?.

Because of this buff mechanic, people will main a pj and never alter, cuz it will be a pain in the ass

[Vile]

38 minutes ago, Gamb said:

As i said, this change looks ok to all players that starts today. But next week when everybody will be at Luna. Who will party the few newcomers, or the casuals that are underlevel?.

Because of this buff mechanic, people will main a pj and never alter, cuz it will be a pain in the ass

Guess you'll have to wait til next week to find out, won't you.

[Gamb]

3 minutes ago, OwlchemistVile said:

Guess you'll have to wait til next week to find out, won't you.

there's no need. i went to sleep, now everybody is over lvl 30+ 

[Vile]

Yeah, I'd be 50-60 if it weren't for the downtime, but that was to be expected. lol

[Harlot]

Is the new Cleric skill tree accessable to see yet? obv no one has hit 2nd job yet but I was wondering if it was posted somewhere else.

[lorenkill]

I've been playing rose for 12 years, I played on Aura Rose, Rose Online BR, and they all had the same dynamics. I'm having difficulties with my cleric since it doesn't have the same skills (buffs) as in the traditional Rose, and there isn't a skill tree that we can base ourselves on, do you think about improving that?

[HOME]

have you already reached the cleric job?